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  • JackBauer
    started a topic "Charge Offs"

    "Charge Offs"

    I have a general question regarding "Charge Off." I always have to give the excuse that led to this situation. It's not like we were derelict of duty on our part, but my son and then my wife procured the need for serious surgery within a year of each other. One of her symptoms was dizziness, disorientation, etc. She was already barely functioning and I didn't realize that she had gotten so far behind. By the time I figured it out it was too late, the time period was too long and the debts were charged off. That was about 3 years ago I believe. Since then, knowing we were not out of hot water yet, I chose to blow them off because one of the illnesses is cancer. It turns out its not as serious as we initially thought, but left untreated it could easily move to more dangerous locations. Simply put, my wife, the mother of my children, is far more important to me than my credit history.

    But, while talking to my banker at a company owned credit union, I mentioned filing bankruptcy or just paying it off. She looked at me like I was crazy and told me that once the debt is charged off it's really pointless to pay it off because the "collectors" get most of the money and really are harrassing you for money that isn't even theirs. She told me that bankrupcty wasn't necessary because in 7 years it falls off your report.

    Any more information on this that helps. The creditor is known for high interest rate that we used in an emergency to replace a broken AC. My wife ran a home daycare and with all those toddlers and babies in the house it was too dangerous in our area to ignore it. Now, the debt, once $4500 is showing up as $12,000 and the same creditor seems to be relocating where the calls come from, Asset ??, supposedly known for harassing calls. I told them about 2 years ago to stop calling my cell phone but this past year they started calling again. I have that plus a free VOIP service that records all the calls that come in. They call a lot. But I have them on call blocker, but somehow they end up getting through. I block them to avoid the harassing calls, which increases anxieties in my wife, and thus makes her more susceptible to a recurrence of cancer. What should I do?

  • CCM620
    replied
    About being judgement proof
    Well for me I lost my job 2 1/2 years ago. I have lived since then on unemployment+family. I have credit card debt of now $90,000 spread over 7 cards (was around $60,000 before I defaulted). I now rent an apartment, lease a car, have no property or homes, and keep a checking account with $1,000 or below. In my state of SC, there is no wage garnishment law and judgements are non renewable after 10 years. I am in the process of receiving my first judgement from BOA after about a year and a half of defaulting. So, when I get a default judgement in a month or two, I have no liability. Now, if you are smart and play it right you can keep your situation the same for 10 years and if you can't, then bankruptcy is there for you. So when I say I'm 100% collection proof, I mean it.

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  • JackBauer
    replied
    I used to get phone calls from creditors for the guy that used to have my job. I simply told them "he does't work here any more". Ironically, his wife is a doctor with her own practice.

    Okay, I keep reading about of some being "Judgement Proof?" I only have 2 outstanding debts that I never was able to pay up before it went rogue on me. Now it's like dealing with the ever determined "Jack Bauer" of "24". yes, that's partly why I use the username.

    1) How much does it cost to file in Texas?
    2) Would a family of 5 making less that $50K be considered untouchable? If so, why and if not, why?
    3) How long would it be today in order to be able to refinance a home, or buy a new car, etc?

    I know that the rules have changed since I filed the last time in 1998, which is why I've been avoiding it. I wanted to see if the creditor would ever pull their head out of their duffel bag to actually sincerely work with me as some creditors have in the past. Obviously some creditors are more legitimate than others. I never fill out any store credit card and basically tell the recruiters to suck an egg... but in a nice way. I teach them "don't ever do that", it will always blow up in your face should you stumble. I'm a walking financial educator now. Once our children are out of the house, I can easily see our standards jumping up tremendously. But that won't be fore a while. By the time my daughter reaches college, I'll be 62. Between now and then, i hope I don't need clean credit. In fact, since I want to teach I doubt it matters that much. I get the feeling that all of the creditors have information somewhere in their huge databases that we've filed anyway in the past.

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  • GoingDown
    replied
    Originally posted by HHM View Post
    I think we are making a larger point, it is not that C&D letters work, or do not work; it is that C&D letters don't solve the underlying problem.
    I understand that.

    Any of my debts that are not past the statute of limitations are still underlying debts, but I got the phone calls to stop. I have peace and quiet again, and none of my relatives, friends, neighbors, or former employers are getting any calls about me.

    One of my charged off credit card debts has already slipped past the statute of limitations, and this particular junk debt buyer never sued me, so that debt is gone. It will never have to be paid. If they did sue me, which I think is highly unlikely, I could use the statute of limitations as an affirmative defense against the lawsuit and win against them. I would also have a $1000 counterclaim against them for violating the Fair Debt Collection Practices Act by filing that lawsuit against me after it is beyond the statute of limitations.

    The rest of my debts will fall, one by one, beyond the 6 year statute of limitations in 2012. I suspect that none of the remaining ones will file a lawsuit against me. They have been silent for quite awhile now. And I don't plan on waking any of them up with any collection triggers on my part during the next year.

    I was able to avoid filing bankruptcy, avoid paying the fees, following the path of least resistance by doing essentially nothing, and I waited them out. And if I ever needed the nuclear option of bankruptcy at some point in the future, it is available for me to use immediately-- No waiting period!

    Not everyone can do what I did, but if someone is essentially judgment proof, and is self-employed, there isn't a whole lot that the creditors can do, or that they want to do about it. It is too difficult for them collect anything from people like me. They don't want to waste their time, money and effort going after people like me.

    And here's one other benefit of my way-- in 2013 my credit report will not have any negatives on it. They will have all aged past the 7 year limit, and believe me, I have kept all the old copies of credit reports to prove it as well, if necessary.

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  • GoingDown
    replied
    Originally posted by CCM620 View Post
    I think in most cases a cease and desist letter will do exactly what it is meant to do, stop telephone calls. Nothing more, nothing less. I think the vast majority of creditors do and will comply with them, though there are some exceptions. I sent my first one and have many more to eventually send. With the underlying debt, that is a seperate problem. In my circumstance I have been sued the first time, am 100% collection proof, and live in one of the most debtor friendly states. So in some people's cases, getting rid of the telephone calls is half the battle. I can and will receive judgements, but they are not enforcable after 10 years in my state, and if I decide I have something to lose before that 10 years is up, bankruptcy is there for me. So, as I've said before, everyones situation is different, and you cant project your circumstances or the laws of your state on someone else.
    Very good point.

    For people who are essentially judgment proof, getting the phone calls to stop is the main objective. For the vast majority of people they work very well.

    I suspect for at least some of the people they didn't "work" on, what may have happened is they started hearing from a new collection agency for the same old debt. At first, original creditors and junk debt buyers will bump the account around to several different collection agencies, and each new collection agency must be sent a new cease and desist communications letter-- by mail, fax, or email-- to get them to stop calling.

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  • CCM620
    replied
    I think in most cases a cease and desist letter will do exactly what it is meant to do, stop telephone calls. Nothing more, nothing less. I think the vast majority of creditors do and will comply with them, though there are some exceptions. I sent my first one and have many more to eventually send. With the underlying debt, that is a seperate problem. In my circumstance I have been sued the first time, am 100% collection proof, and live in one of the most debtor friendly states. So in some people's cases, getting rid of the telephone calls is half the battle. I can and will receive judgements, but they are not enforcable after 10 years in my state, and if I decide I have something to lose before that 10 years is up, bankruptcy is there for me. So, as I've said before, everyones situation is different, and you cant project your circumstances or the laws of your state on someone else.

    Leave a comment:


  • lillymarlene
    replied
    Originally posted by HHM View Post
    You can spend as much as you want on postage sending letters, it won't change the basic facts', you owe a debt and you are not paying it; courts really aren't that sympathetic.
    2008 to 2009 I must have wasted my time and money on at least 50 C&D letters to collection agencies. These letters work for awhile, then at least in my case anyway, it seems that they may have helped trigger a couple of lawsuits on my smaller balances.

    I chose to attend the "pre-trial" phase of my first lawsuit, since I didn't believe in letting a bill collector easily win by default. Then, it looked like my local courthouse had turned into a giant collection agency. Just from watching other people, I knew I didn't have a snowball's chance in H*ll.

    The only thing good to come out of this, was that this was the final event that pushed me into deciding to file BK.

    Leave a comment:


  • tobee43
    replied
    Originally posted by HHM View Post
    I think we are making a larger point, it is not that C&D letters work, or do not work; it is that C&D letters don't solve the underlying problem.
    thank you LOL!! you're correct, they may stop the calls for a bit, however, the next thing you know you get a summons at your door.

    however, they absolutely didn't work for me. but filing bk most certainly did.

    Leave a comment:


  • HHM
    replied
    I think we are making a larger point, it is not that C&D letters work, or do not work; it is that C&D letters don't solve the underlying problem.

    Leave a comment:


  • GoingDown
    replied
    I would say what happened to you was the very rare exception, not what happened to me. There are a lot of people on this forum who can tell you that cease and desist letters do work to get them to stop calling.

    It even worked on the collection agencies that were calling us about our deceased relative's debts.

    Leave a comment:


  • tobee43
    replied
    Originally posted by GoingDown View Post
    Speaking from my own experience, the cease and desist communications letter has worked to STOP PHONE CALLS from every original creditor, junk debt buyer, and collection agency I have sent it to, except one-- West Asset Management. With them I had to file a complaint against them with the Arizona Department of Financial Institutions to get them to stop calling.

    So yes. It does work. I know it works. It worked for me personally. On a ton of charged off credit card debts.

    It gave me peace and quiet.


    And I should add that most of them were sent with a simple cheap first class stamp. Some were sent as a free fax, and some were even sent as email. They all worked fine, with that one exception-- West Asset Management.
    well goingdown, you were certainly one of the lucky ones indeed, as not one of ours worked, including those that went out directly from the law firm we hired. whom also contacted each of our creditors by certified mail and it did absolutely nothing, ....until we actually filed for our bk.

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  • DYLAN150
    replied
    Just last week a collections outfit starting calling me. I googled their phone number, got their address and fax number and sent them a fax asking them to stop calling me. I have not heard from them since. So I will stick with the fax machine when possible.

    Leave a comment:


  • GoingDown
    replied
    Speaking from my own experience, the cease and desist communications letter has worked to STOP PHONE CALLS from every original creditor, junk debt buyer, and collection agency I have sent it to, except one-- West Asset Management. With them I had to file a complaint against them with the Arizona Department of Financial Institutions to get them to stop calling.

    So yes. It does work. I know it works. It worked for me personally. On a ton of charged off credit card debts.

    It gave me peace and quiet.


    And I should add that most of them were sent with a simple cheap first class stamp. Some were sent as a free fax, and some were even sent as email. They all worked fine, with that one exception-- West Asset Management.

    Leave a comment:


  • tobee43
    replied
    Originally posted by HHM View Post
    Basically, I am not one for futile efforts. Okay, so you send a letter, whop-tee-do, as if that is going to do anything?

    When novices start doing "research", what they fail to realize is that there is a vast difference between "having"
    rights and "enforcing" those rights.

    You can spend as much as you want on postage sending letters, it won't change the basic facts', you owe a debt and you are not paying it; courts really aren't that sympathetic.
    i really don't understand why many feel a C&D letter, or any letter will stop any action. as you point out, you can spend as much time and effort and postage and they do absolutely NOTHING! i don't get why many don't understand until a creditor actually sees a docket number, better yet, is actually notified by the courts of the BK...they will simply NOT STOP! hate to say, but creditors have rights as well, although mostly viewed as the enemy by the time you are ready to want to write one of those letters. chances are, one didn't feel that way when they were dishing out credit or money to you.


    JackBauer, time away is always good, to clear ones head, to have a peaceful moment or two to review one's situation. honestly, once we filed that petition, we just filed the entire process away, didn't even think about it, only as the steps proceeded, we took one at a time, slowly, and carefully. at that point, it was in our atty's hands and the courts hands. that worked for us and we didn't even give it a thought until our 341, after that, we also put it all away until day 63 (which we were totally aware of) in mail comes the two orders, one the discharge and one the close. so glad we didn't take our time and energy stressing even more, shoot, we had spent the 3-4 years prior to the filing for all of that!

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  • JackBauer
    replied
    Good luck with that . I'd recommend time away from whatever's got you so down. Holidays? I get down during holidays too.

    Leave a comment:

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