Des / JB - ya'll still around? Gotta ? for you

[Pandora]

Hello Mr's. Des & JB

Question: House not included in CH. 13 (notified but not "included" - direct pay) - no claim filed, etc. Been having one hell of a time with them sending monthly statements for payment and then stopping for 3-4 months at a time before I turn up the heat, getting into multiple correspondence, then magcially..they start again. Basically left doesnt know what the right is doing and vice versa.

I know somewhere in the Code there is something about payments on "non-included" items, but for the life of me I cannot find it. I'm tired of going back and forth with PNC regarding all of this - and their latest reply from the Exec. Office is that the payment statements for the past 2 years have now been "in error" ... here is part of their "official response"

.....When a bankruptcy is filed the loan is coded as such, we are not permitted to issue billing statements, coupon booklets, or allow payments to our website. You had received billing statements previously in error. Once this error was caught, the statements were immediately stopped according to Bankruptcy guidelines. The Executive Office has received special permission to have billing statements sent to you each month.

"special permission" my ass...WTH is wrong with these people?! I have previous letters from the heads of PNC regarding this very issue stating "oops..we screwed up.. you ARE supposed to have complete access to your account as well as receive coupon / statements for payments..our bad.."

Ugh. Any info you have will be greatly appreciated so that I can get a permanent stop to what they're doing. I'm so tired of trying to educate them *sighs*

Thanks!

[AngelinaCatHub]

Can't attempt to answer but FYI yes Des and JB alive and well. I'm sure they'll pop in some time today. 'Hub

[IamOld]

HI Pandora - yeah, I would love to have statements from HSBC - my only assurance - so to speak - is that I can see the balance go down as they report on wife's credit report...so they're crediting payments...

And Des, I am assuming they HAVE to send the interested deduction statement right? i shouldn't have to ASK for it...?

[despritfreya]

Oh dear Lord. I think I am too tired to even read Pandora's post. I will look at this in the am.

By the way, Pandora, where have you been? You never call, you never write (post - at least I have not seen any recently). I was beginning to think you don't love us anymore.

Will respond in the am.

Des.

[lillymarlene]

Hi Pandora, My mortgage is being paid outside of my Ch 13, too. Then since my loan was sold to another bank, 6 months ago, I've yet to receive a "normal" statement. They seem to be tracking my payments, property taxes are being paid, but the statement says, that $0.00 are due. If that were only true. :-)

[despritfreya]

Ok, I didn't wait til morning. . .

Pandora,

I believe the Code provision you are looking for is 11 USC 524(j) which allows a creditor secured by the debtor’s principal residence, to continue to seek payments in the ordinary course of business between the debtor and the creditor - in other words, send billing statements post discharge. But this provision deals with the effect of the discharge injunction, not the automatic stay. I see no similar provision under 362(b). So, while your lender is an idiot, I think you will have to continue to deal with it as you have in the past.

Des.

[justbroke]

From my experience, it is just that they don't want any appearance of issues. Additionally, most large lenders use one of several systems for tracking loans (yes, it's almost like Best Case for bankruptcy!). In that system, they have codes to detail the status of the account. Once they put a bankruptcy code on the account, they treat that account different.

So, if they were to change the code to say a normal code, then attempted to harrass you about not paying -- or something -- then they'd be in trouble for violating the stay. It's a tough place to be.

As I said in another thread, these bankruptcy departments and in-house counsel really don't seem to know what to do.

[lrprn]

Interestingly enough, during our entire Ch 13 Chase Home Finance (holder of our first mortgage) and our small local bank (holder of our second mortgage) sent us an "informational statement - this is not a request for payment" form in the mail every single month detailing our last payment, how it was applied to our principal, escrow, and interest, and how much we still owed on both loans. Sounds like we were pretty lucky to get this from our lenders compared to what others are describing here.

The mortgage companies can legally send out monthly informational statements to bk filers if they want to. I still believe that some lenders won't do it solely as a punishment for filing, even though if the filers keep the house the lenders will still end up getting exactly what the original loan terms required. It's really sad to read about these legal but immoral games the lenders play with us when we're the most financially vulnerable.

[Pandora]

Oh dear Lord. I think I am too tired to even read Pandora's post. I will look at this in the am.

By the way, Pandora, where have you been? You never call, you never write (post - at least I have not seen any recently). I was beginning to think you don't love us anymore.

Will respond in the am.

Des.

Dearest Des my luv...

Why.. I've been looking for you, of course. You ran out on me, dont you...*sniffles*..remember??? Oh my..I'm crushed...crushed I tell you! Wine me and dine me then just like a lawyer..send me a bill...





Ok, sorry..but you know I just couldnt resist ;) Hiya sweetcheeks! Thank you for the info - I was looking under 4001-2 but it didnt seem to apply in this particular instance, or not that I could tell. ?? I am so tired of arguing with the idiots about it - cant even imagine how screwed up its going to be once we finish our Ch. 13 plan and try to get it back to normal. Ugh.


@ JB - well hello there stranger! Thank you also for the info - its simply amazing that here they've been sending them (and not "Information purpose only" type of statements - actual BILLING statements) and then 3-4 times a year, they suddenly stop. Vicious cycle for some reason and trying to get them to re-send takes an act of God almost. Why just yesterday after receiving their email reply... what do I get in the mail? ...a frigging coupon book! Uh yeah...so I went from pre-BK filing a coupon book, to post BK filing a monthly billing statement, to no statement..now this - yet their Exec. Office claims they're doing me a "favor"? *slaps forehead*

Hi Lrprn - missed ya!